Resilience, Innovation, and Purpose: Building Dottid and Making a Meaningful Impact - Kyle Waldrep: Proptech SaaS Founder

**Garrett** (00:00:00) - Hello. Welcome to the pod with Garrett Elconin. And this is where I interview local entrepreneurs and solopreneurs, ranging from business founders and entrepreneurs to creatives and artists, to peel back the curtain on on their success and their stories so that hopefully we can extract some tools, tips and tactics that they use to become successful. And through that, I hope to inspire you, the audience, as well as hopefully give you some tangible things you can apply to your personal or professional life so that you can grow and live the life of your dreams. Well, I'm thrilled to be speaking with Kyle Waldrep today. He is the visionary founder and CEO of Dottid, a venture backed startup founded in 2018. Here in Dallas, Texas, Dottid is a commercial real estate SaaS technology company with a revolutionary all in one workflow and asset management platform. At the heart of his mission is a bold vision to become the asset operating platform for every owner globally. Kyle has a grand vision here, and believes that accomplishing this monumental goal will be a catalyst for creating an entirely new asset class.

**Garrett** (00:01:20) - Dottid grew from an idea on a napkin. Kyle raised $850,000 off that napkin, and since has secured over $20 million in funding. And then during that time, Covid shook up the business world where Kyle led a pivotal investor meeting that became a company defining moment. But believe it or not, all this happened after a chance encounter with the mosquito sidelined his college tennis career and changed his life forever. So we are in for an incredible story here with Kyle. So thanks for joining us on the podcast. Welcome.

**Kyle** (00:01:57) - Yeah, Garrett, thanks for having me. It's going to be fun.

**Garrett** (00:02:00) - I'm excited for this. So, uh, well, let's dive right in. There's a lot to talk about. Uh, let's start with, uh, senior year in high school. Who is Kyle? And, uh, what are you what are you working towards then?

**Kyle** (00:02:12) - Uh, senior year of high school. So I wanted to go play college. Tennis and tennis have been a lot of my life and ambition for, I would say, the previous 10 to 15 years.

**Kyle** (00:02:22) - I started playing when I was much younger, at about age 3 or 4, and loved the sport. I had to choose between tennis and baseball, basically sixth grade or so. Um, and so tennis really became I wouldn't say it was like an identity, but in a lot of ways it was what I spent the most time doing. Um, junior and senior year of high school. Obviously, the pivotal times for recruiting and conversations and trying to figure out where you want to go, um, ultimately came down to the University of Tulsa and SMU, and, um, my family's here, so I have older siblings and they have kids, and I wanted to be around the family and have them be able to come to matches or see me or, you know, I come home at certain points, etc.. So SMU was a logical choice. My parents also went to SMU, have multiple degrees from SMU, so it's a little bit in the blood. Um, University Tulsa had a had a, uh, only a puncher's chance on that decision, unfortunately.

**Kyle** (00:03:15) - Uh, but, uh, yeah, ultimately I did SMU and my life was seemingly pretty normal. I went to, um, move in weekend and then everything. Everything changed.

**Garrett** (00:03:26) - Everything changed. Well, I guess dive right in there. Yeah, but as a former tennis player, I can relate. Tennis is a great game and a lifelong passion in game, so it's a great sport to continue on in life, whether it's the business or, uh, or just having fun with it.

**Kyle** (00:03:40) - Yeah, I, I'm, I love it. I was, uh, pretty fiercely independent just from growing up. And tennis taught me a lot of great life skills around how to utilize that independence in a very fruitful manner. Um, it's kind of only you out there on the court. And so, um, headed to school and was excited to be part of, uh, the team and, you know, do the things that you do. I think I was I just turned 19, uh, entering freshman year of college.

**Kyle** (00:04:04) - My birthday's in August. So I was right on the back of my birthday, and I was at Move-In weekend. And, uh, just hilariously, the fun fact of the day is that Dallas was the epicenter of West Nile cases in 2012, and this was the summer 2012. And so ultimately, um, I got off the bus about four days before college at the like Welcome weekend retreat. You meet people, it's a little awkward, but so be it. It's college and everyone's kind of there and full sending everything. And so, um, I got off the bus, I got some mosquito bites on my left ankle and didn't think anything of it, and actually remember joking with the person who was next to me like, oh, I'm going to get West Nile. Um, sometimes you speak things into existence, which is unfortunate. And, uh, yeah, a few days later. Right. I was really fine. Um, Thursday past, Friday past, Saturday past. And then Sunday, Sundays.

**Kyle** (00:04:59) - There's like a little convocation, uh, thing for SMU, which is actually really neat. My parents were there. They were, um, it's kind of like convocation for the incoming freshmen. You do the same thing as outgoing seniors. And so my parents were part of that tradition, which was really cool to share with them. And then we went to dinner, uh, for, for the Dallas people that would listen to us. We were at Goff's Hamburgers back in the days. It was on Hillcrest before it burned down and moved to mockingbird. And, um, I was fine. Went to bed in my dorm, woke up the next morning, I had a fever and I was sick. And I don't know who remembers their first day of college freshman year so specifically like I do, but I was that kid. Which that kid, the first day of freshman year of college is not a great impression on on the professors. When you're sick and you've definitely looked like you've either been totally hungover for three days or you've done something else that's not productive to your well-being or something, and, uh, you're just kind of first day into college, and that's just not a great look.

**Kyle** (00:05:56) - That's also not me, which is pretty amusing. And so I was definitely that kid in class. Um, I had three classes at Monday morning, and I was sitting in the back and not talking to anybody, and I was talking to me because no one wanted to be near me. I was coughing and sneezing and all this stuff. It was bad. So I went home, um, to my parents house, uh, midday, and had a sandwich and got in bed. And my life changed from that point on. So I got in bed at around 130. And the only reason I know this is so specific is because I don't remember a ton past this. So it kind of shuts off here. But, um, so.

**Garrett** (00:06:30) - Several months, you just kind of blacked out and.

**Kyle** (00:06:32) - Don't recall about 6 to 7 weeks I did. So yeah, I went to bed. I woke up eight hours later. I took an eight hour nap in the middle of the day, which was highly unusual since I'm not a nap person.

**Kyle** (00:06:44) - Um, and my mom had actually ended up waking me up for dinner at 9:00 that night, and. Kind of. The rest is history. Um, I was sick. We didn't know what initially was wrong. My mom had been pretty fierce about checking me for mosquito bites and things during the summer as I was practicing tennis outside, but we didn't really know what was wrong. I was still functional, so you could have had a conversation with me. I was pretty glazed over neurologically. Um, so I didn't have a lot of like high capacity interaction capability or like I was, you know, super intent on the conversation, but I was very functional. Um, and in our family, there's kind of like, no days off. So I was still going to class. My parents were dropping me off at class. I was still semi living in my dorm. Um, tennis was totally out of the question because I wasn't going to be able to make the fitness requirement. So that was done, like done.

**Garrett** (00:07:41) - And then in, in, in high school, I mean, you were an athlete. You're running. Oh, I.

**Kyle** (00:07:46) - I had to the fitness requirement that year for tennis was a 530 mile, which a 530 mile is moving. Um, it's one thing to run like a seven, you know, a seven minute mile and like, you know, you're running and like, you do it. Okay, great. 530 is a whole different game because you're starting to run laps at, you know, a minute, ten a minute 30, like you're starting to figure out that pace and that's just different. Um, so I my playing weight going into college was around 177 to 182. Um, and to give you an idea of where I ended up actually later that fall. So at Thanksgiving, I weighed in about 135 or below. And so I was, um, and I was still eating multiple meals a day. It wasn't like I just killed my appetite. But the the virus was so active inside my body that I was losing weight quickly.

**Garrett** (00:08:34) - Yeah. So and so. Yeah. So tennis was immediately out, and, uh, did you ever think that you were going to get back on the tennis court and in college?

**Kyle** (00:08:41) - Not really. I, I never thought I'd pick up another racquet. I mean, I was so sick that I didn't think normal life was the first objective. And anything past that was a was a real win. Um, but I didn't think I would really pick up a racquet. I obviously stopped practicing. Stop playing, you know?

**Garrett** (00:08:57) - And this lasted how long?

**Kyle** (00:08:59) - So this was close to two years. Um, frankly, some of the timelines a little bit, uh, hard to nail down just because of how things happened, but, um. Yeah, I was sick for for a long time. I actually ended up picking up a racquet again. Um, like, strangely, the spring of my freshman year, that was a total waste of time. I had no body. So that lasted for, I think, one hit and then didn't pick up again for a long time and then made a commitment to myself, uh, as I started to progress and feeling better and put a little bit more weight back on, like I got it back up to 160, I think entering, uh, second half of sophomore year.

**Kyle** (00:09:35) - And um, again, college experience was totally different. I was not I was not doing college. I was just trying to survive and, and do life and do classes. So, um, there was no, you know, partying or anything like that. It was just survival. And so, um, I'm in a commitment. The summer after my sophomore year that I was going to get my spot back, or at least get offered my spot back on the team, uh, by the beginning of my senior year. So I had one year to do it and I had no body. So my first practice lasted for 25 minutes. And I couldn't move, um, because I would get so winded. And, you know, it's not like I was super overweight or anything. I just had a virus. So ultimately, long story short, came to, um, came to practice for about 14 months and try to figure it out. And then coach at the time told me I needed to beat some players that were currently on the team.

**Kyle** (00:10:26) - And I think you put 3 or 4 people in front of me and I. Beat them in a set and, um ultimately decide not to take my spot, which was I knew I wasn't going to be in the lineup. There was no way he's going to put me back in the lineup. As a senior who had never played over guys that had been recruited, that was never going to happen, and I totally understand that. Um, then got offered a assistant called volunteer assistant coach position on the women's team. So got to do that my senior year and also got to intern for President Bush. Um, at the same time, which was really the main driver, I knew that interning for President Bush was going to be a probably a once in a lifetime experience. And so I wanted to take advantage of that. I can always hit a tennis ball.

**Garrett** (00:11:04) - No kidding. Well, that's that's quite a unique and different college experience for anyone and especially for you, given what you thought that college experience was going to be like.

**Garrett** (00:11:14) - Totally. And, you know, I'm of the belief that, you know, adversity builds character and sometimes you don't have control of things that happen to you, but you do have control of how you react to them and how you overcome them. So what would you say? Some lessons for both yourself personally and what you learned about what you learned about yourself personally and about the world from contracting that?

**Kyle** (00:11:34) - Uh, totally. A lot of lessons that I'm actually currently applying in the business world. Um, you have to keep going. You keep moving. When you stop, things are dead. That's just how it works. You never know what's around corner number two or number three or number 400. Um, a lot of roadblocks that I learned in that period just to, like, getting normal life back. Um, I mean, to give you an example, I actually lost the ability to heat and cool my body during the course of the illness. And so, um, I remember we went on a we went on a family ski trip.

**Kyle** (00:12:10) - Uh, this was either six months into my illness or nine months in. It was very shortly after I got sick and I was frozen on the mountain. I was like, I'm just chattering in cold weather. And then ultimately that next summer, um, I couldn't be outside. And I was like, what is happening? What is going on? So, um, long story short, that was just something I then had to begin to deal with. And I could either take the attitude of I'm never going outside ever again, or I'm never going skiing ever again, or I'm never doing XYZ because of these things. Or I can take the attitude of I have to manage it. I have to know how to deal with it. I have to learn how to, you know, have a cold towel on my neck if I'm going to be outside or whatever. And really, by the God God's grace, I've gotten ton better with that. And so I can now be outside, which is nice in the summer because Dallas is very hot.

**Kyle** (00:13:00) - Um, but ultimately, yeah, there's just a lot of lessons if you keep moving and you just figure it out, and when you decide not to figure something out, you decide you really decide to put yourself at a disadvantage. Um, because you're not allowing anything around you to come and interact with you to help make the situation better. You're just making an initial decision to cut something off or to not move forward or etc. and so I've had to learn that that's not really how I want to live my life. So that's.

**Garrett** (00:13:31) - Powerful. And, you know, in entrepreneurship and in life, you always have kind of that negative person devil on shoulder and then the positive. So how did you keep listening to that positive person? I mean, did you have something to go back to or. Yeah. How did you just keep on listening to that?

**Kyle** (00:13:46) - Yeah, I think a lot of it stems back from how I was raised and my family, and I think my faith as well. I think my parents are hard chargers.

**Kyle** (00:13:55) - My mom is, um, has a great, wonderful life story herself and just how she views the world. And we were raised, um, in an environment in a home that had high expectations and was I wouldn't say it was performance driven. I think that's given a bad moniker in this day and age. But I think it was, uh, it was the expectation that you were going to use what the Lord's given to you for good, and you are not going to stop until that's been accomplished. And so, um, that meant a lot of long nights studying. That meant a lot of, uh, you know, hard conversations and growth opportunities when I was growing up. And so, um, yeah, that's where I would attribute it to my mom's also, um, really a medical legend in her own right. She started the first female women's obedience practice in the state. So, um, that environment fostered an attitude that I get to go live out today.

**Garrett** (00:14:46) - That's quite an inspiration for you to.

**Garrett** (00:14:48) - And big shoes to fill.

**Kyle** (00:14:49) - They're big shoes to fill. Always.

**Garrett** (00:14:51) - Yes, I'm sure a supportive environment which helps in such a a low point in your life to to have family like that around. Yeah, they.

**Kyle** (00:14:58) - Were um, they were fantastic. I think they were scared, just like I was of what's going on. And, you know, I'm the third child and the other kids are off and doing their own life. And, um, there was a lot of time and attention and effort focused on trying to get me better. And you couldn't really do anything. It wasn't like a a pill or a shot or a whatever. It was. Tincture of time and tincture of time sucks because you don't know if you're going to get better or not. And I think very thankful to only have been sick two years instead of ten years. 15 years, etc. so great.

**Garrett** (00:15:32) - Way to look at it. And I'm sure that has transformed in the business world as well. And your mindset and mentality.

**Garrett** (00:15:37) - Yeah.

**Kyle** (00:15:38) - Totally. Totally.

**Garrett** (00:15:38) - So let's uh, get into how how did you find real estate?

**Kyle** (00:15:42) - Uh, real estate found me. Uh, I, I actually blame a guy named Ryan Mcmonagle. Uh, thank you. Ryan, who was at KBS, uh, we were an award ceremony for my mother in November of 15, and Ryan was in town, and, I guess invited to this thing. And he showed up and he sat next to me. I don't know how all of that worked, but so be it. Um, and at the time, I was looking to go to law school, and my dad was a former bank attorney. And, uh, frankly, for a lot of reasons, intelligence reasons, neurologic reasons and, and health reasons, I probably was not cut out for law school immediately post-college. And so we made the decision just not to do that and not pursue that. Well, I had interned with a federal judge the summer before, and and that was really the path I enjoyed and was passionate about at the time.

**Kyle** (00:16:27) - Um, that was off the table. So now we're at square. Zero square one somewhere and trying to figure out what the next move was. And ultimately, Ryan sat next to me and I told him, you know, looking at commercial real estate, I think, uh, in Dallas, what do you do when you're 21, 22 and don't know what to do with your life? You go be in commercial real estate because that's just the way the the game works. And so, uh, that's what I did. That's what I did. Ryan ended up connecting me with three guys. That led to three guys, which led to ultimately 50 guys. And I met a lot of folks, had no idea about the space, was not a business major. So I was at the Dedman School at SMU for uh, Liberal Arts and, uh, in the communications school in Meadows, because I was going to go to law school and that was the deal. And so, um, yeah, Ryan Ryan connected with a lot of folks and enabled me to follow up with him and just said, hey, go figure it out.

**Kyle** (00:17:23) - So I started figuring it out and started understanding the leasing side of the business ten rep side, the equity side, etc.. Um, and was actually going to go work for a brokerage here in Dallas, uh, right. Post-college. So that's where all of the interviews and the emails and the applications and all things went forth. Um, what really changed is during my interview process, I didn't ask a ton of questions about, like, you know, how much money can you make and all that. I think those are the those are the obvious, lucrative parts of commercial real estate. I really wanted to ask and find out what was wrong with the space.

**Garrett** (00:17:53) - And in these interviews you're talking about the informational casual interviews, casual.

**Kyle** (00:17:57) - Coffees and lunches and breakfast at cubbies and not.

**Garrett** (00:18:01) - Not the actual job interviews where you're asking them these types of not those.

**Kyle** (00:18:05) - Actual job interview, uh, times, but really just when you're meeting people because I wanted the flavor of, like, these people are in it every day.

**Kyle** (00:18:13) - You know, some HR person is going to tell me whatever they're going to tell me, that's fine. But the people that are in it every day are going to be the people that ultimately I'm going to be dealing with. And commercial will say it's so relational that it would be amiss for me not to know what drives them. Not to me, for me not to know, you know, what motivates them and what they like about the space. And so that's where I spent time, um, technology was part of that. It was not the main part of that, frankly. I wasn't gunning for like, oh, I'm going to go build a tech tool and ruin, ruin the world or save the world. Like that was never the attitude. It was really more just everything coalesced around this idea of inefficiency, around the lease process and ultimately around assets themselves. And I think for me, um, I ran with that. I don't know if that's wise or stupid, but, uh, it ultimately happened and, uh, was going to work for a brokerage, um, and went on a tour.

**Garrett** (00:19:02) - Get onto that. Yeah. So what type of questions were you asking these interviews? You said.

**Kyle** (00:19:06) - Yeah. So I was asking what platforms they would use. Um, email was like. Answer one a through one Z. Um, but ultimately, you know, how did accounting fit in? And did you use anything to like, when you went on a tour of a commercial office space or a medical office space or a retail space, like, was there a digital link post the tour to have all the information instead of in a printed out book? No, there was a printed out book. Um, and so just again, like, and it's no fault, it's not a fault or a of, you know, discouragement towards the space. It's just like it's where the space was. And there's that means it's ripe for innovation.

**Garrett** (00:19:43) - Yeah, absolutely. And I, I did a similar thing with informational interviews and, and landed in commercial real estate and thought it was, uh, a very good use of my time.

**Garrett** (00:19:53) - I learned a lot because it's a large industry, and I mean, especially as a student. No one's really going to say no to you. And if they do say no to you, it's probably not someone you want to continue maintaining a relationship with. And so it's a perfect opportunity as a student. And then, you know, still, when you're in your career to learn information, people love talking about themselves. They love sharing what they know. People are very open about that. And so do you think why you ask these questions out of curiosity, out of trying to find a way to stand out as what drove these questions?

**Kyle** (00:20:25) - I'm sure it was probably driven out of this idea of like they go to numerous of these breakfasts, lunches, coffees, etc. and no doubt everyone's asking similar types of questions. And I wanted to be a little bit off of that spectrum. Um, and I think that that my goal was to find out, to be honest, I think ultimately my end goal was, hey, if I'm going to go be competing in this space because commercial real estate's competitive and brokerages are competitive, owners are competing for deals like it's just how it works.

**Kyle** (00:20:53) - I want to have the best ability to go succeed as a most junior person as possible. And so all of that is putting arrows in my quiver of just information, to your point. And it was it was great and easy because I didn't do a lot of talking. They told me everything. And so I'm just soaking in information and knowledge sets. Um, knowledge is power.

**Garrett** (00:21:13) - It is. It wasn't like, let me find a weakness in these businesses and commercial real estate to launch $1 billion branding company. Nope.

**Kyle** (00:21:21) - It was not that I that was so second secondary is kind maybe tertiary to anything that I was doing. Now I will say towards the end of the all these breakfasts and lunches that I was having and you know, and I was also not a I was not a top recruit at all. Like I didn't come out of HBS or McCombs or Wharton and have, you know, two years worth of internships on my lap and all this stuff like that, not me. So, uh, as I kept getting denied by some firms, put through the process, more by other firms, etc..

**Kyle** (00:21:54) - Um, I really just started thinking about how would I differentiate myself through utilizing technology, um, in the space. And this was spring of 2016. And so light research. What platforms are out there? What do people use? Why do they use it, what's valuable, what's not, etc. etc.. Um, and ultimately really started, I would say, shaping questions towards the end of the interview, interviews and coffees etc. that really led me towards like, okay, what's the problem? How do you solve for that problem? How do you go do it, who's part of that, etc. funny enough, there's actually a couple guys that I met with early on that are now customers. So that's that's how maybe.

**Garrett** (00:22:34) - Some are others are investors. Exactly.

**Kyle** (00:22:35) - And that's how crazy the world is, is if I just said again, back to the West Nile story, if I had said no to that, that just shuts everything else off. So anyway, full circle.

**Garrett** (00:22:45) - And I think the part about standing out is so critical.

**Garrett** (00:22:49) - And that was one piece of advice that I got during my informational interviews was, why real estate? Everyone's going to ask you that. And don't just blurt out an answer, figure out how you can stand out. And one way I thought about that was, well, if I'm the interviewer asking that question, what is the common answer? I always hear, oh, I love real estate because it's tangible, you know? That's how differentiate it from stocks and bonds. Well, if you say that you're just another similar person as everyone that come before you. So whether it's real estate or any other business, figure out why you like what you're pursuing and. Think about something that's more unique. And I think that's a that's a great point and a great strategy.

**Kyle** (00:23:31) - Yeah. You got to figure out the passion point for sure.

**Garrett** (00:23:34) - Yes. And then so you had all of these questions. You got a ton of data points. One obstacle. I feel like a lot of aspiring entrepreneurs, uh, face and stop them from starting is they feel like they have so many ideas they don't know which one to pursue.

**Garrett** (00:23:52) - So how did you come up with Dodd's business plan or idea was the one to pursue?

**Kyle** (00:23:59) - Uh. That's a great question. Um, it was frankly, the only one I knew to pursue. I knew I went on a it's funny, there was a very. Galvanizing kind of cataclysmic day. Um, for me, for a lot of reasons. Um, that was just right post-graduation, I mean, within ten days post-graduation. And I was going to be ultimately hired by this firm. But I went on a tour with them in the morning, and we were touring some space, and there were tenants in from DC and Seattle or somebody, whatever. Fine. And I just started asking questions at the end of the tour. And of course, no doubt the leasing agent was like, who's this joker that we're bringing on that is talking out of turn, which is totally correct. Um, and I didn't know what I was talking about, but I was trying to ferret out information around how this process would move forward with this tenant and would it be digitized or not, and ultimately found out it would not be digitized and ask questions about why and only making the leasing agent even more just mad, which probably my bad.

**Kyle** (00:25:03) - Um, because you.

**Garrett** (00:25:04) - Were asking inappropriate questions. Yeah. You should not be asking. I shouldn't be.

**Kyle** (00:25:07) - Speaking. I mean, that's kind of how the game is played, and that's okay. That's fine. Um, but for me, I was just like, I'm going to send it and why not? So, uh, that ultimately led to, um, yeah, going back to that office and turning down the job and coming down the elevator, calling my mom in the lobby and saying, I had an idea to go. Try and fix how leasing operates and create efficiencies there. And then ultimately, that was what I pursued for the next 26 months. So that was call it June of first to June of 16 till we raised money. August of 18. The idea was to create the first true workflow based lease product to get all parties actually to a transaction in one spot. Now, as you can imagine, that's not how real estate works. Having the tenant side and the asset side in one spot is not really the game currently.

**Kyle** (00:25:59) - And so ultimately I had to pivot off of that idea. And that was the first idea. But that first idea didn't become what we've now built today. Um, and so but you had to purchase through something. I mean, it wasn't just a like, it's going to happen. Like, I knew what we I knew what I wanted to do, I just needed to go refine it. And so really spent the next two years trying to refine it. And people were unbelievably gracious with their time and, and their, um, at their own talents to, to give me access to information and to fake leases and to fake docs and just show me how the world worked. Uh, to where settled on exactly what we needed to do to go raise money and what the business plan was and what the pricing was, etc.. Um, yeah. To go make it happen.

**Garrett** (00:26:43) - That's and pivoting is crucial in the business endeavor. And some of your early investors are real estate folks, maybe all of them.

**Garrett** (00:26:52) - What role did they play in the early development of dotted, as well as the early development of Kyle himself? Yeah, so.

**Kyle** (00:26:58) - Super, super crucial in the development of me. I was a young pup. Uh, I just turned 25 when we raised money. Knew nothing. I mean, I remember being scared to death those first six months. I was. I remember waking up like, four weeks into, uh, having the money in our account and being like, we need to give this back.

**Garrett** (00:27:16) - That 850,000 raise off of a napkin.

**Kyle** (00:27:19) - Yeah, that's that needs to go away. Um, because I didn't know how to build a product. Lead a team. I mean, there's just so many things that, um, I've had to learn over time, and, um, they were super supportive. And that was. I mean, at that stage when you've got no product, no team got a slight business plan, you're really just investing in the person. And they were they were gracious enough to ultimately invest in me and what my crazy ideas were for the space, I think.

**Kyle** (00:27:48) - And no doubt we'll get into this later. I've got a lot of thoughts on on the space and how it's played out. Um, but yes, were they helpful initially? I think some more than others. Um, I think some people were trying to figure out, like how we were going to pull this off. It's not. And this is one thing I just didn't know. You don't know what you know until you know it. Uh. It's not what these things where I was like, I know exactly how we're going to pull this off and know exactly how much money we need. I know exactly who we're going to target and know exactly how it's going to happen. None of that's the case. You actually know none of those things. And that's the beauty of it, because you're trying to figure it out each day. And one door is typically leading to a next. And whether the door opens or shuts is always the question. Um, and, you know, it's just a really sweet time to go learn about yourself.

**Kyle** (00:28:36) - How do you handle adversity? How do you handle be told? No, I've been told no more in my life than I've been told yes. That's how most people operate. But I've been told no like a lot because people thought I was nuts, I was nuts, I had no commercial experience, real estate experience. I had no business experience.

**Garrett** (00:28:52) - No tech experience, no.

**Kyle** (00:28:52) - Tech experience. And I was a solo founder with a non-technical. Person on the team. So odds were not in our favor. Um. And that's okay. That's how it works. Um. Just like odds could be in your not in your favor because of the market. Odds were not in our favor because it was just the setup. Um, and so ultimately, yeah, started trying to figure it out. We, uh, brought in one of my best friends, uh, to be, um, lead our product, and we outsource some of the development initially and then ultimately brought that in-house, hired a CTO.

**Kyle** (00:29:26) - And obviously we get into some of the rest of the story. The rest is history. But, um, I think initially we got into the development of me that's led into the development of the business. There's so many things that I look back on that I would do differently 20, 18, 19 and 20 that I just know now because, you know, experience is the greatest teacher. And, um.

**Garrett** (00:29:49) - And I.

**Kyle** (00:29:49) - Know now, you know, what, what's.

**Garrett** (00:29:51) - A prime example of one way that the investors help mature you faster than the trajectory you were going on?

**Kyle** (00:29:58) - Yeah. So, um, they taught me the business, which I needed to be taught the business. I was pretty good at Google, um, and books and magazines and articles and anything anybody would send me or I could get my hands on. But teaching me the business hands on, uh, was a big deal. I remember, um, one of our investors who's now a current board member, and she's the best.

**Kyle** (00:30:20) - She's literally the best. Just got on airplanes with me. Got on airplanes with me. We went to meet. I remember one meeting we met with the CTO of Prologis. Two months into the business. Um, we had no business being in the room. He was so gracious. He's become a friend to this day. Um, and. He was like, if you can go pull this off, this will be a big deal. You'll be you'll have a product. And it was just one of those things where when we were there, that 45 minute meeting with him was fantastic. But she and I just walked around Embarcadero Center, taught me the business, how it worked. Who invested here? Um, you know, Boston Properties, ownership and other people and the pier. And, I mean, it's just one of those things where you take the time to nurture and steward, um.

**Garrett** (00:31:07) - Osmosis, just being in the presence of someone that's so knowledgeable. And for those who don't know, Prologis is the largest industrial company in the world.

**Garrett** (00:31:15) - Boston Properties is the number one office landlord, I believe. Both traded on the stock market there. Yeah. And? Your approach to raising capital and calls early on? Uh, for those in the audience, calls on plenty of podcast interviews. So that's where I've gotten my research from. So don't think I'm stalking Ryan like that. Just does some digital. But you had quite a unique approach to your calls where you would you would start off these calls in a very humbling way. Trying to recall. Where is it? Mhm. Do you remember what you would. You would say these calls.

**Kyle** (00:31:53) - Oh, man. I would typically give the investors most of the reasons why this would never work. That was generally the case. Um, I was a, uh, not a self defeatist, but in a lot of ways I was thinking about, like, all the reasons the investors should never invest. Um, because I think that's the only right way to handle it. Um. There's no guarantee we could be out of business tomorrow.

**Kyle** (00:32:18) - We could be out of business in six months. We could be out of business in 60 years. I have no idea. Um, I don't know what the market's going to be. I don't know how hard it's going to be to deliver a product. I don't know how hard it's going to be to go in and execute what we're doing. I don't know if anybody will buy anything. And so typically a lot of our investor conversations were here's the vision, here's what I think can happen. Here's why. Happy to be told wrong and happy to be wrong. But here are a lot of the reasons why this won't work. And to be really, really candid, some of those reasons have come true. Um, but thankfully less currently less have come true than than what is, uh, come not true. Which is nice. Uh, but I think for us. Yeah. Just wanted to. Put it all out there. That's how we've run the business. It's all. It's all in front of you.

**Garrett** (00:33:06) - Yes. And in addition to that, you. I believe you would say I don't know anything near what you know, my hope is to learn a fraction of what you know, because you will forget more than I know. Yeah, exactly. And when you would say that, I would imagine not a lot of founders would come in the room and say that, let alone, you know, mid, mid 20 to maybe late 20 year old founders would come in that humbly and say that even though it's everyone knows it's a fact. And so what. Tell me what like the investors response was that was and the energy in the room and how that shifted the conversation. Yeah, it's a great point.

**Kyle** (00:33:38) - I think, um, the response was generally a either a wry smile or a chuckle. Um, I think some people looked at me and was like, oh, it's some fake humility. Whether it's fake humility or not. It was what I believed. Um, I, I believe that like, I believe that sitting in the room with our customers, I don't know the business.

**Kyle** (00:33:57) - I don't know their business generally. Just like they're not going to know my business. Um, and so, uh, a lot of our investors, especially the real estate ones, have forgotten more about real estate than I probably will ever know. Um, I mean, there's men and women that have built incredible businesses, uh, on, you know, the owner investment management side and the pension fund side. And, I mean, they've done serious things in the space. And, uh, I'm not going to have that knowledge because I'm also not going to live there experience. And that was I think the level set for me was it's not coming in trying to be better than I am or create this big shadow. It was just a let's go figure it out together. And if you're on board for it together, then this should work.

**Garrett** (00:34:41) - Here are the facts, and I'm gonna put it all on the line here on my cards. And I think that's quite a unique approach. Is that a similar approach to how you negotiate? You kind of put all your cards on the table and or is that kind of changed?

**Kyle** (00:34:51) - Yeah.

**Kyle** (00:34:51) - I'm not a like I don't like to hide the ball. That's not me. I don't like people that are what I term as non-serious, uh, people that are non-serious or people that hide the ball or don't tell the truth or whatever. Like the facts are the facts are the facts. It just is what it is. And those facts may all be bad. But they're still facts. And I think, again, I don't know when you want to get into this, but, uh, a lot of the real estate world, I think, can be, um, sometimes marred in the behind the, you know, behind the door and underneath the table. And we're out on the golf course and, uh, we're just, like, trying to wheel and deal and figure it out. And I think that there just has to be, uh, for the operational efficiency to increase in the space. I think there has to be a level setting of facts or facts and deals or deals, and let's go do it, you know, in the most aboveboard fashion possible.

**Kyle** (00:35:42) - It doesn't mean it can't happen on the golf course or under the table or behind the door. It just means that it needs to happen with, I think, transparency, which leads to clarity.

**Garrett** (00:35:51) - Transparency, which leads to clarity and simplicity also in the design and in the product. Let's dive a little bit deeper into the product. And yes.

**Kyle** (00:36:00) - Yeah. So the product is, uh, a lot different today than what it was when we first started. We were building a leasing workflow platform to start and brought that product to market, ultimately call it April, May, June, sometime in there of 2021. Um, there was some critical decisions made around, you know, do we focus on industrial real estate? Obviously, that became a big deal in. Late 20 tens, but really accelerated obviously in Covid as everyone's likely aware listening and and yeah ultimately brought that product to market and got 7 to 8 customers initially within the first like 8 to 10 months. I think what we saw initially was that.

**Kyle** (00:36:41) - What we had built was nice and was usable and I think well designed and had great, um, interface for the customer and the personas that were using it. But people wanted a lot more. And this goes into a much larger real estate discussion. But what we pivoted to or pivoted to made a decision to build. It was frankly always what I wanted to build, which was really the operating system for the asset. And the operating system for the asset really encompasses a lot more than leasing. So it's it's debt, it's capital projects, it's valuation. It's for me, if there was enough capital in the world, it would be acquisition disposition like there should be similar to how there is a back facing operating platform that all owners use, whether it's multi office, industrial, retail, someone uses Entrada, RealPage, MRI or Yardi. Those are the sources of truth. They always are. They have been for decades and they will be until someone unseated them. Great. On the front side of the asset, which I would look at as more of the front facing capital side, there should be a source of truth for leasing capital projects and debt.

**Kyle** (00:37:44) - There's no reason that shouldn't exist. Um, and so for us, that's what I want to go build. And that's where we're continuing to build, and that's where we continue to execute on day and day out. And, um, that doesn't mean this market is willing to accept it. That doesn't mean this market wants it. That just means that based on what I see in the space and the conversations that I have with people market, that's where the future of the industry is, whether we are around to see the future or are the future. I have no idea. Uh, but that's what we believe and that's what we're chasing after.

**Garrett** (00:38:16) - That's an exciting goal and exciting mission. And would be I see the benefit in the industry.

**Kyle** (00:38:21) - Yeah. I think our customers, um, our customers that used to use the product or um, I think really enjoy everything we've put together. Does that mean that tech solves all your problems? No. Does that mean tech creates problems? It does. Uh, and does that mean that tech, uh, is the ultimate end all be all answer no, it doesn't.

**Kyle** (00:38:42) - Uh, tech is a part to a whole that also includes relationships. It also includes coffees. It also includes, uh, sourcing deals in different ways. It also includes a lot of things that real estate's always going to do. But tech is a buffer, uh, towards efficiency and something that I think can push operational expertise to a new level.

**Garrett** (00:39:02) - That makes sense. And so speaking of tech and with a background not in tech, sure. How have you, you know, gotten up to speed. And also, you know, I believe you've raised over $20 million. And, uh, there's several instances where where founders can be kicked out of their own company by investors if they don't believe in the founder. So how have you proven yourself as the, the one to to steer the ship and guide dotted into the future to take on this bold vision?

**Kyle** (00:39:28) - Yeah, that's a great question. Uh, our CTO has been unbelievably beneficial to the growth of our business. I mean, he's he, um, was a long term relationship that actually my father and I had and someone that we trusted from day one to go build the right platform and do it the right way.

**Kyle** (00:39:43) - And he's done that. So, um. I haven't really gotten up to speed in a certain sense. I'm not going to go code if he's doing something else. That's not how it works, but I think there's just a level of trust and and breaking down the walls together to go build the right thing for the space and to do it the right way with the right compliance and the right security. I think one of the one of my little hot button, before I answer your second question on this space is there's just a lot of vaporware that's built in proptech. And I think that that's been something to navigate for us. And I think it's definitely something navigate for the market. But vaporware really is saying you're going to build something and you don't. And we put it out on our website, what we've built and what the updates are. And if you want to see it, great. We have our security compliance URL that you can go visit trust.com if you want to go see what our uptime is and how all of that works.

**Kyle** (00:40:38) - That's your deal. That's how we operate. That's what we try and do. Um, and I think there's just other companies out there that don't have that same posture, and that's an individual decision. I can't force people to have the same posture as us. But I know that when someone uses us, they're going to get what you know, we say they're going to get and that's that's the goal. It doesn't mean that it's it's perfect, doesn't mean it's it's doesn't have bugs or isn't going to have issues. But it does mean that we're we're trying to deliver exactly what we say we're delivering.

**Garrett** (00:41:09) - Well, I think that's that's amazing. And I wish more companies would do that. And a lot of people say that a company is a reflection of its founder. And we obviously heard earlier you're very transparent about how you communicate. And I think that the values of DoD, it definitely stemmed from you. And that's just just a sign of, uh, you know, transparency.

**Kyle** (00:41:29) - And yeah, I think to answer your second question on how they've kept me around, I think the board is kind to keep me around.

**Kyle** (00:41:35) - Uh, it's been a struggle. It's been successful. It's been a lot of things in between. We've scaled up, we've scaled down, we've done. We've done a lot of stuff. And, um, I think the board, uh, hopefully overall recognizes that there's a vision to go out here and to go create and, um, whether or not we're right or not, I don't think it's ever really been the board's question to me. To me, it's not in a business. You're not about like trying to be right. You're trying to build the right thing for ultimately the end customer. Now, whether or not there's enough in customers to sustain that business, grow that business, and make it exceptional at a certain given time or certain given market, that's always the question of business. We could have the total wrong timing. We could also be totally set up to go succeed for the next five years. It all just depends on once you get in market what people use, what their feedback is and how you adjust to that.

**Kyle** (00:42:28) - Um, and I think we've tried to do that as well as possible. It's not perfect by any means, but it does mean that we we lead with the information out front, and then we ultimately we let market decide. That's how it works.

**Garrett** (00:42:41) - Yeah. And I think, you know, the the investors and board and, and employees believe in the vision not because it was created a thin air, but because you believe in this vision and you tell them and you have a vision for the company. And specifically rewinding, uh, Covid happened, which, you know, right in the middle of when you were probably fundraising. Let's, uh, let's rewind a little bit and talk about Covid. You know, take us back there and what was going through Kyle's mind and this kind of pivotal moment in the company's history.

**Kyle** (00:43:10) - Yeah. So February, March of 20, we were 6 to 7 people. Um, no office. We were remote. Um, trying to figure it out. We had no product yet.

**Kyle** (00:43:20) - We had like a, I would say clickable screens that had Covid on the back of them, but no fully functional developed product you could go sell. Um, and yeah, I remember hosting a investor call. mid-April of 20. I mean, just talk about a period of so much uncertainty. First off, I have two family members in the medical industry, so that was uncertain. Just number one. So my life was very isolated at the time, as was most people. And uh, second, I had this business and we just raised some money and so we had to go build something or sit on the cash. One of the two. Um, but if we're going to sit on the cash, it wasn't going to be. It's going to be for a long time or an uncertain period of time, because Covid didn't seem like it was going anywhere anytime soon. So, um, just so many things that were rattling around in my head and how you make a decision. I ultimately told our investors, we need to keep building, we need to keep going, and didn't know where real estate was going to be and didn't know if Covid was going to last through May of 20 or through May of 25.

**Kyle** (00:44:22) - I had no idea, but ultimately knew that we needed to build a product that was right for the space, regardless of what the the external black swan climate was. Um, there's always going to be another. And so I didn't want to build out of fear, but I wanted to build out a conviction, uh, that the vision was still the same vision. And it may look different at the end of Covid. That has played out as exactly how I thought. Um, not in specific asset types or sectors, but I knew it would look different. And it does. Um, and yeah, that was it. And. It is so amusing. You have all these very smart people on this investor call. And Covid was a great equalizer in terms of someone's knowledge set and ability to make a decision. No one knew. No one had a clue. And so you make the best decision at the at at that time and you don't look back and second guess it because there's no way to know, you know, how to make another decision at the time.

**Kyle** (00:45:18) - And so it was just.

**Garrett** (00:45:18) - About, you know, gathering consensus or telling them, hey, the guys, we got the money, the fundamentals of the fundamentals, and let's go build and hire and and let's go do.

**Kyle** (00:45:27) - This. Yeah. That was the that was the idea. Um. That again, didn't know that was right. Obviously he also had an election year that year. That was a whole deal. You had just so many things went on that year, obviously. So, um, it was something that we just had to go. You just had to go do. And if you. Don't go. And do you just kind of cut yourself off from whatever opportunities come of come from doing it? So, um, that was a lot of the attitude.

**Garrett** (00:45:53) - Yeah. And then boom, kept, kept building, growing, got revenue, got clients customers got clients.

**Kyle** (00:45:59) - Um, and then really at the beginning of January of 22, made the decision to go build out the asset management platform, which.

**Kyle** (00:46:08) - This decision was one that was really built on the backs of our customers. And again, beginning of 22, you're coming off of this massive surplus year, which is pent up demand from Covid and tech valuations being crazy and money being everywhere. And all this stuff that happened 21 and really, 22 is the beginning of the beginning of the end. Sounds dramatic, but in a lot of ways like it was the total sheering of the cliff of the cycle between basically post GFC, uh, to what is now the repricing of real estate, in my view. Um, and that call it 1213 year period. And so. There was just a lot. There was a lot that happened in 22, and we were spending money left and right, because I believe that real estate needs a front facing operating platform. And I believe that even more sitting here today, um, that is like the conviction is only deepened because of what I've seen in market. And there's so many things to talk about with this. We could go into special services, we can go into interest rates, we could go in a lot of directions.

**Kyle** (00:47:13) - The net net, before I let you ask the next question is really we had a conviction. I want to build a product. We have built that product. Um, again, back to an earlier point, whether or not that product is successful long term, I have no idea. But I know we have customers. I know our customers who use it, enjoy it and love it and are growing. Um, and we just were trying to get new customers in a really, really tough market now.

**Garrett** (00:47:36) - Yes, and need that customer love even more. But better to have 100 customers that love you than a million that like you.

**Kyle** (00:47:43) - Yes, exactly.

**Garrett** (00:47:44) - You have some thoughts on adoption versus engagement? Sure. So speaking of, you know, getting customers and retaining them and seeing data for what it is and what's real, that or not. You talk a little bit about your thesis on that. Yeah I do.

**Kyle** (00:47:58) - So, um, back when I was starting the business, you would read all these metrics and conversations online from the great VCs that have funded the world's best businesses that have come out of the United States, especially on the tech front, whether it's a Facebook, Instagram, a WhatsApp, etc. and and those are B2C, but you've got plenty of B2B businesses as well.

**Kyle** (00:48:18) - So, um, etc. there's a lot of conversation around adoption of platform and adoption is in the commercial real estate space a four letter word? It just is, because there's just not a proclivity by the masses, and the masses are the end users towards actual adoption of anything real estate people are deal people. That's all that's the industry is made up of those types of people. Yes. Do you have people that have backgrounds in finance or you have people backgrounds in legal or general business or marketing? Of course. But adoption is a word that just I never could equate with our actual end user base. Engagement metrics are way better because in any type of platform, no matter if you're using your back end system of of truth, like an accounting system, like a yard urine MRI, yeah, you're going to have certain people that are your product champions that are going to be in it all the time. Okay, great. So they are adopting it. You're also going to have people that interact with it.

**Kyle** (00:49:24) - Like there's a difference between actual true conviction and adoption in in a platform. And there's interaction with the platform. That interaction could be hey, I'm I'm in it twice a week. A minute, four times a week. I open it up every morning to look at it and I shut it. Engagement is such a way better term for how, in my view, the proptech space should be looked at. And I mean look no further than other platforms in the space that deal with like tenant engagement. There's a reason it's tenet engagement, and that's a whole sector in Proptech. It's not tenant adoption because tenants are going to engage with different things at different points in time. And there should be a platform that allows them to engage with, like a work order request or getting coffee down at the coffee shop in their lobby or their access control into the elevator like they're engaging with those things. But are they adopting it? That's a totally different conversation. And so, um, without me going much further, uh, I think that that's.

**Kyle** (00:50:25) - That's where this space is really hard, because in other businesses there's much greater adoption. Um, buy in from an in persona and end user in commercial real estate. It's a it's a flimsy like, malleable thing that you have to build a product in, um, you know, to get someone to, to go use it and engage with it. Point in case and I'll give you an anecdote from our business. We have a deal terms page. Well, every owner is going to underwrite their lease deal terms differently. That's how it works. And they're going to do it on Excel. And they're going to do it with their ArcGIS models that they did on Excel. And then put the numbers into Argus and then re got out of Excel. It's just how the game works. And that's fine. But that's the hardest page on our platform. To ultimately build out because every owner has a different metric. Someone does a yield on cost, someone doesn't do a yield on cost. Someone looks at additional rent differently than someone else.

**Kyle** (00:51:28) - Great for us. I'm not trying to get our customers to adopt that page. I'm trying to get them to engage with that page. So we've built different features that's inside of that page to enable them to go into Excel, because that's where they're going to go. Regardless. I would be a fool not to do that.

**Garrett** (00:51:42) - And so that's you working with the customer. You got not kind of butting heads with that. You got it. Yeah.

**Kyle** (00:51:47) - I if I butt heads with him, you and I are sitting here because I don't have business and I may not have a business even doing what I'm doing, but at least I'm taking in the user intake to where that is fully formulated as we're trying to build out what we're trying to build out. It would be irresponsible for me, as the ultimate product owner at our business, as CEO, to not look at it that way. And and again, that's where I think. For a lot of reasons. Commercial real estate has a long way to go in terms of building great technology that's user driven.

**Kyle** (00:52:18) - Um, and what's hard is that there's just a lot of different users have a lot of different opinions.

**Garrett** (00:52:22) - Yes. And then, you know, I think both of us can say that real estate is, you know, geared more towards an older crowd or that's currently is a large portion of the the employees in there and owners and deal makers. And so how do you think about engaging with technology and the design of it. So therefore it it can be engaged in more.

**Kyle** (00:52:44) - Simplicity and usability are the two words that we've always used. Um, if something's not simple and usable, it shouldn't be built. So that's that for us is is how we think about it. Simplicity first is great design. Limited clicks, less page click thrus or slide outs, more up downs, etc. we had, um, we've had great design work on our team for years. Um, and it's been exceptional to see a product that looks the way it does. I think we get a lot of compliments on that, which is kind.

**Kyle** (00:53:15) - Um, and usability is ultimately the fruition of the simplicity in a lot of ways. If it's simple, typically people use it. Um, think about Airbnb. Airbnb is very simple to use Vrbo, very simple to use Instagram, simple to use Google. Google simple to use like.

**Garrett** (00:53:31) - Still hasn't changed exactly.

**Kyle** (00:53:33) - And simplicity typically leads to usability. I think what's amusing about the end user base in commercial real estate is, no matter how simple you build something, there's always people that never want to engage with it. And that is that is the challenge of a generation of leaders in this industry that don't have a proclivity towards technology. They have a. A bias, not negatively, but they just have a bias to how they've always done it. And again, it's not a slight it's just let's talk about what it is because that is what it is. And there's a younger generation that grew up with an iPhone and grew up using social media, and has a real onus on wanting to make technology the forefront of how they operate IT.

**Kyle** (00:54:18) - Business technology ultimately breeds efficiency, um, and.

**Garrett** (00:54:22) - Efficiency hopefully equates to more money. And so with deal makers, it's how do I make more money using this? And it's hard to see sometimes in unless you see it in the long run and really engage with the product for, for a good amount of time potentially.

**Kyle** (00:54:37) - Yeah. And I think that that's what's so hard about Proptech right now is that no one's come up with the ultimate, um, you know, everybody on the owner side of real estate is like, what's my NOI? It's my net operating income. So my expenses, my income. What's the net of all that? Okay, great. Well, it's like, what's my net operating return from a technology platform? That's a super hard metric to to find. You've got a broker that may be on the field that's trying to do deals and sauce and hunt and do his job or her job. What's their return? How is it measured? That. I mean, those are like the grand old questions in real estate that I think if answered correctly, um, can really provide a strong benefit to the space and really provide an incredible.

**Kyle** (00:55:25) - Value proposition to the end user, but it's just hard because there's not like to me, there's not enough buy in holistically in the industry to go solve for that initial question of like, what's the net operating return in a lot of ways for these platforms. And so when it's like partially buy in or like some buy in, but not all the way, then you've got this like really weird middle ground where some owners are going to use and emphasize technology and they're going to be more efficient because of it. They may not be able to totally measure it day one or day 30 or day 100, but they know operationally that they're better because they're doing it. And then you just have a whole swath of ultimately owners that. They're not. They're going to have platforms because they have platforms, but it's not really actually part of a thesis or a value proposition. They're trying to drive inside the organization with their people. And so you sit in this weird gray area of like, it's here, but I'm not maybe trained on it, and I'm not maybe supposed to use it for all these things, but we're paying for it.

**Kyle** (00:56:20) - Well, that's a that's where the space is right now. And this is, um, the space will evolve. Ten years from now, it'll look totally different. They'll be way better companies than, uh, than what it has built. And way better founders than me. No doubt. They come forth and do it in a in a different way. I think AI is a very quick, ultimate path to go down on, like how some of this gets solved. But that's a conversation for another time. Um, and you know, it will change, but it's we're in a murky middle ground, especially because of the market, uh, right now, today.

**Garrett** (00:56:55) - That makes sense. Well, speaking of where we are currently, and let's talk a little bit about the future you mentioned. I sure there's maybe some blockchain behind some things. And what do you see as the next couple of years and three five year path for, for dotted and who, you know, any potential listeners or partners who would you like to attract to your dotted.

**Garrett** (00:57:13) - Yeah.

**Kyle** (00:57:13) - So data really operates office, industrial, retail um main main owner type owns between call it 500 and A in 1,000,000ft² to up to 20,000,000ft². So think lower middle market, think yes, definitely some institutions because there's fund managers that own, you know, smaller portfolios, etc. but um, generally outside of the like institutional realm of what you would consider. But, you know, we're also talking to those institutions as well. I think, uh, for us, what we're trying to do is, is execute on the vision, which is to be the operating platform for all commercial real estate owners, um, locally and abroad. That's for us. That's what we want to go do. Um, and that's the vision and that's what we're trying to go execute on. So, um, that's as simple as I can put it, uh, where we want to go. So we want to keep building on what we've already built. We know our customers want more of what we've got. Um, and we want to continue combining the data sets between leasing capital projects and improvements, uh, debt and valuation.

**Kyle** (00:58:11) - We've got an integration with Argus, which we think is really powerful. We've got integrations with Yardi and MRI as well, and I think so we're going to just keep running down the path. Um, capital customers. We'll see. Uh, would love for anybody to check us out. Uh, dotted is dotted. Uh, so if you think it's an EA, it's not, it's an AI. Um, but I think for us, like, we're going to run down the path simply. So, uh, I heard a great quote, uh, back a few years back, actually, when I was starting dotted and, um, it was, you know, you never know until you kind of simply start and you start simply. And for us, we're we're following along that path. Uh, shout out to Jonathan Pluta for that quote. But, um, we're we simply started and we started simply and that's grown. And so we want to go keep doing that every single day. If that can be, um, our moniker, then that's a great moniker.

**Garrett** (00:59:03) - I love that I, uh, another one's kind of similar is, uh, big things start small. Yeah, that's what maybe Bezos said. But those those monikers really help you put things in perspective, especially when you, uh, have your head in the clouds, but your feet on the ground and have to keep on marching and the the day to day atmosphere there. Yeah. And then, uh, you know, a few more, you know, things that you mentioned, you mentioned how, you know, closed doors have enabled more of dotted to exist than open doors has. Can you just expand upon that a little bit?

**Kyle** (00:59:34) - Sure. So, uh, a closed door is when someone says no or not now or never or laughs in your face. I've had all of these.

**Garrett** (00:59:43) - Uh. And which you believe no's mean.

**Kyle** (00:59:45) - Knows are no's are always maybe and maybes always. Yes. And that's how my that's my attitude. It has to be. Uh, because if it was no was a no.

**Kyle** (00:59:54) - Then again, we wouldn't be sitting here. So, um. Yeah, I think closed doors have always enabled dotted to succeed way more than open doors have only in the sense because it no is typically, uh, how you get to. Yes. And so for us know always made us rethink. How do we get to. Yes. How do we build something different? How do we raise money differently? How do we partner differently? All of these are just little nuanced questions outside of the larger framework of a know. And um, for me, that's just how I've had to run the business. Um, we've, you know, it's an uphill fight to run a business and start something. And the hardest thing you can do in business is take something from ideation to someone paying you for it.

**Garrett** (01:00:36) - 0 to 1, 0.

**Kyle** (01:00:37) - To 1 is always hardest thing. I told an advisor a couple weeks ago, the next hardest thing is going from 1 to 2, where you're in into multiplication and you're into growth and success.

**Kyle** (01:00:47) - That's the next hardest thing, there's no doubt about it. And we're trying to teeter that line of growth and success. But we've done 0 to 1, which is great. Um, can we do 1 to 2? We'll see. Time's going to tell on that. But I'm confident in our conviction. I'm confident in our product. I'm confident in our people. And so those are three great things to be confident about. And so, um, yeah, a lot of no's have have been the reasons that we're here today.

**Garrett** (01:01:11) - That makes sense. And especially that that first. No, but when you're getting a no, what I think is important is not the no. But the why behind the no. And that's how you can adapt and change and figure out the why. So you can create those features that make that why into a yes. And that's what's key. That's I love that there and then you know, a few kind of quick, just personal ish questions about Kyle and how you, you know, obviously you lead a successful company and people trust you with a lot of money and all that stuff.

**Garrett** (01:01:44) - And a busy man. So thanks for taking the time here. But, uh, what's something you have eliminated from your life that's made the biggest impact?

**Kyle** (01:01:51) - Oh, man. Whole my my whole life. Yes. Okay, great. Um. Oh, wow. Uh. What's something? Uh, so I'll give you two things. One was actually a diet related thing. Funny enough, I stopped having caffeine, which you may think as an entrepreneur. That's crazy. I don't do coffee, and I don't do tea. Um, and I made this decision, actually, back when I really decided to pursue college tennis. So I drink a ton of water. Um, yeah. So I'm. I am constantly full of water. Uh, and and things like that, but, uh, there's no, no caffeine in my life. And I think that's just made a from a health perspective. Again, not a slight to anyone on caffeine. My parents must have like 5 or 6 Diet Cokes a day, so it's, uh, it's just how it is.

**Kyle** (01:02:39) - Uh, but for me, that was the right call. And that just that eliminated a lot of options. Um, I didn't drink a ton of sodas growing up. I didn't have a ton of coffees. It's also saved me financially. I'm not at Starbucks every morning, um, or at the coffee shop, so, uh. That's good. I think also for me, what I've eliminated is, uh, to be really candid, I eliminate negative, negative people. I just don't have the time. And it's not out of arrogance. It's literally just out of the fact of, like, there's enough negativity, of trying to push forward what I'm trying to do. And the business and negative people are a time and energy suck. And so for me, um, Jonathan McLeod also challenged me with another statement, which was, uh, you know, if you feel like you need to change your playmates and your playground, go do it. And so, um, I've been graciously blessed with a lot of great friends and a lot of great, positive people in my life.

**Kyle** (01:03:36) - But if you're not positive, you're probably not around me. That's just kind of how it works. And, um, we want to be positive. We want to be upbeat. We want to be, uh, engaged. And, um, negativity just isn't part of that.

**Garrett** (01:03:49) - I think that's wonderful. Those are two phenomenal answers. Yeah. Yes. And then I mean, to elaborate a little bit in business, as a visionary, though, you can maybe go kind of too far in the in the clouds and see something. How do you surround yourself? Because I'm also speaking for myself. Sure. Here. Sure. How do you surround yourself around people who assess your vision carefully and and dissect it? Not in a negative way, but as a way to, you know, see some potential roadblocks, risks mitigate that.

**Kyle** (01:04:20) - I try and have, uh, numerous people check what I'm thinking or doing. Um, anybody that knows me that's close to my life knows that I've got. I almost have, like this.

**Kyle** (01:04:33) - Not kind of paralysis by analysis. It's definitely not that. But they know that I just run things by a lot of people. Um, that's just how it works. And frankly, multigenerational, I believe very strongly, very strongly in multigenerational mentorship. That is like a massive deal for me. Um, because I believe the different people at different parts of their life have different wisdom. Um, and that's just that's how life works. Like the guy who's 78 and has run companies and been successful and is now retired, sees life differently than the guy who's 52 and has three kids that are between 8 and 20. Different life stages, and also a different from the 35 year old who's just married. And so I think that, for me, just allows me to see the world and check myself, um, against men and women that are in different life stages, doing different things and have different experiences to drive what they're going to give me feedback on. And I'm a massive believer in multigenerational mentorship. Um, and so, yeah, that's one of those things that I try and do.

**Garrett** (01:05:39) - Uh, stuff is something I'm going to keep in the back of my head for sure, because history repeats itself. And then so then you kind of assess patterns and see where the similarities are. That that makes sense.

**Kyle** (01:05:50) - It's in a weird way, like I would. I don't think about this in these relationships at all, but for me it's like a like mentally, it's like this subconscious social experiment in a certain sense, because you're totally right about the pattern. It's like. People grow and they gain wisdom through experiences, experiences, the greatest teacher and, um, you know, so something they may have saw 35 they don't see it 45 and like, great. That's that's what I want, I want that I want as much input into that as humanly possible. Yeah.

**Garrett** (01:06:20) - Since we're speaking about real estate, I think the classic example is we work, right. If you went to all of those, you know, very seasoned real estate veterans, Sam Zell, you know, it just all right, it's it's Starbucks with a plug in.

**Garrett** (01:06:33) - I mean, what's what's stopping it's just a coffee desk with a plug in. You're taking long term leases. Breaking up a short term. Yeah. It's not going to work. Right. Um, Masahiro San should have, uh, spoken to some elders there. Yeah. Great. And then. For the audience looking to boost their well-being. What's your go to life hack or daily ritual that keeps you on the top of your game? Besides the no caffeine?

**Kyle** (01:06:56) - Yeah, so no caffeine. Um, goodness, I. I really try and prioritize sleep. This is going to sound super stupid and simple, but like I prioritize sleep and I prioritize people that I love. That is like. And that's super cliche. And you may be like, yeah, no kidding. And okay, great. I'm not one of these people that's like, I don't meal prep on Sunday. I don't read a bunch of granola blogs on like how life should happen or someone on Instagram tells me it should happen. I don't.

**Kyle** (01:07:30) - That's not me. I'm way too basic or I guess not basic for that, I guess. I don't know whatever way you want to look at it. Um, but I am like, I just, I take a very hard look at like, who are the successful men and women in my life that I look up to and what they do, um, they prioritize family. They prioritize people that they love. They prioritize getting some sleep. Uh, and my parents were actually on the board of the center for Brain Health here in Dallas, and they did a massive sleep study a few years back. And, um, it's something that hit home with me on, just like what that does to the brain. I mean, it's not rocket science like the Lord created us to sleep. There's a reason that there's the weekend. Sabbath is real. Um, this whole attitude of like, hard charge til you die attitude is, that's not me. That's great for other people. Uh, but. Again, I want to prioritize the rest and the Sabbath and the sleep to ensure that I'm as much on top of my game as humanly possible.

**Garrett** (01:08:30) - I think that's simple, but so great to hear, especially from someone that's, you know, working hard and founding a company and not trying to boast about something or be someone they're not. And obviously that culture, like your other values, you know, goes into the company culture. And I'm sure it'd be a great place to work. Adopted.

**Kyle** (01:08:48) - We think so. We hope so.

**Garrett** (01:08:50) - Speaking about being on boards, you are very active in the community. Can you talk a little bit about that and how DoD has allowed you to, you know, think about life kind of more grander or not grander, but yeah, a higher level.

**Kyle** (01:09:02) - Sure. So I'm, um, I've had the real distinct privilege to be a young life leader at Saint Mark's, which is an all guys private school for the last, the last eight years. Um, I started senior year of college, and, um, it's provided so much. Really just flexibility and also the ability to speak to the kids in my small group about like how life really works.

**Kyle** (01:09:28) - Um, there's nothing to say that. Going and getting a corporate job and doing the thing and growing in your career is not an also an exceptional path. That is. That's great. So hear me. Uh, but I think I've learned so many things in the last five years that some people may not learn for the history of their professional career. Uh, just from what I've seen in the ups and downs and the challenges and etc., um, that giving young men, uh, high school kids that are training to be men, uh, and to be on mission are um, yeah, it's been invaluable. And so I think the business has really been a huge blessing. My Instagram bio literally says that, you know, being a young life leader is the best thing I do. And I believe that, like, that's dotted will come and go. Whether it's $1 billion company or it's A00 dollar company, it will come and go. And the legacy of dotted will hopefully be that we tried to build something great and do it the right way.

**Kyle** (01:10:23) - And whether or not that is a big money maker or not, I have no idea. But the legacy that I want is someone that was faithful to those boys. As long as I had the opportunity to be faithful to the boys. And yes, I want to be faithful to the money we've raised. Yes, I want to be faithful to our employees and our business and everything we've done for our customers and our product. Absolutely. But that goes without saying. The thing I really want the legacy to be about is ultimately, um, you know, there's things to have, like, it's great to have business impact. I want to have life impact. Um, and so that's that's how I see the world. And, um, for some people, that's not how they see the world, frankly. And I've had plenty of those conversations, but I think we try and surround ourselves with people that view the world similarly.

**Garrett** (01:11:07) - That's beautiful. So so to not to keep going, but because I was so beautiful and you have so much wisdom with that, to someone who is trying to find that purpose or that fulfillment, what would you say to them?

**Kyle** (01:11:19) - Oh, man.

**Kyle** (01:11:20) - Uh, goodness. Uh, I think the I think the God's honest truth on all of this is everyone's created for purpose. It depends on how you view. It always depends on how you view self. Um, am I the God of my life or am I not? And I think that's the number one question. Uh, that from a professional perspective I think has to be answered. Um, I have a lot of friends who are, you know, chasing and chasing is great. I'm chasing, but I'm also like. It could be over and it's fine. That has consequences. But chasing has consequences too. Um, and, uh, there's a mentor of mine who I meet with every other Monday who has always given me this example for the last 4 or 5 years about how life is a series of these mountaintops, and there's always a higher mountain, like, you can go hike Pikes Peak. In Colorado Springs or wherever it is in Colorado, somewhere, maybe Colorado Springs, somewhere, I think, uh, but there's always Everest.

**Kyle** (01:12:30) - There's always something that's higher. And this idea of these of life being these peaks and these valleys, like, I just I don't want to chase the peaks. The peaks are, um, fulfilling for a time, but they're often not, uh, worth leaving a legacy over. And I think for me, it's it's always, you know. What do you think about yourself? Are you God or are you not? Do you believe that you're not great. Okay. What does that mean? Cool. Do you believe in something else? There's a I think there's a real proclivity in Dallas, especially in the young adult culture. Um, to be chasing and running and doing. And it's this, like, performance mentality. And again, there's a lot of great things about performance mentality. Dallas is an incredible city with a lot of incredible people that have been very successful, that have made a ton of money. Um, but as my mentor has always said, he would rather have a healthy family than healthy money.

**Kyle** (01:13:28) - Um, and that's that's serious. And I'm not married yet, but that's something that I aspire to have in my life. Um. And if. If that's you as the listener, if you're looking at, hey, how do I how do I ultimately go in and and find purpose? Like, you got to answer the question, my God or someone else God, because that's going to be the foundation of ultimately how you build things. Because if you're building it for yourself, that's a that's a real dangerous circle in my view. Again, it's my opinion. So someone listens to this and they just say, shove it, shove it. Great. But I think for me that's that is where I've built my roots and the foundation I've laid for how I make decisions and and what I believe is valuable.

**Garrett** (01:14:11) - Kyle, this has been a wonderful conversation, great and some great wisdom shared and yes, been great connecting and chatting with you today. Garrett. Thank you. Absolutely.

**Kyle** (01:14:21) - Appreciate it. Thanks, everyone.